Given the huge cultural differences between Thailand and the West, its not surprising that what’s hot in one culture may not be all that in the other. In the two years I’ve lived in Thailand, I’ve seen guys that would be considered pretty average back home end up with super hot Thai girls. On the other hand, I’ve seen guys, who back home would do quite well, get ignored by very average Thai girls. So what’s the deal? Well, after extensive scientific investigation (read: many nights spent partying in clubs) I’ve come to the following conclusions about what’s hot or not in Thailand, which should be of use to any hopeful romantics in the country.
Thai girls want something different – but not that different
The first clue as to what Thai girls want involves looking at the other half of the Thai race: Thai men. Virtually all Thai girls in their 20’s or older will have dated at least one Thai guy in the past. The majority of Thai guys tend to be short, thin, and somewhat effeminate. Foreigners, on the other hand, tend to be taller, heavier built, and more masculine. All these factors can definitely work in the foreign man’s favor – but only in moderation. Most Thai girls want a man who is tall and strong – but not some huge body builder or muscle freak. In fact, most romantically successful foreign guys in Thailand tend to be relatively slim and effeminate compared to other foreigners – though of course larger and more masculine than the average Thai male. So if you read body building magazines and spend hours at the gym pumping iron, you might want to lay off the steroids for awhile before booking a flight to Thailand.
Case Study: The Vin Diesel type is better off staying at Home
Back in the West, a hyper masculine guy with a strong, muscular build like Vin Diesel would probably be considered very attractive to a lot of girls. Not so in Thailand. See point #1. Don’t forget that the average Thai girl is fairly short and as thin as a stick – she’d probably be terrified of someone Vin Diesel’s size! On the other hand, a guy who looks like Matt Damon – someone who is slim, strong, yet with a slightly effeminate face – would do very well in Thailand. So nurture your metrosexual side and you may have to beat off the girls with a stick.
The Clothes Make the Man
Its been written over and over again that keeping a high standard of personal hygiene and dressing with a little class does wonders for the foreign male’s chances of winning over a beautiful Thai girl. Well, most foreign guys in Thailand must be too busy downing yet another Chang to do much reading, because its amazing how poor most foreigners dress in Thailand. I’m not even referring to the neo-hippy backpackers because that’s a whole different story, but to the middle aged guys who show up to a club wearing sandals, shorts, and a Red Bull tank top. In any decent club, restaurant, or bar, the average Thai male will be wearing nice shoes, designer jeans, and a stylist dress shirt. Follow suit and you will instantly be elevating yourself above 90% of the foreigners in Thailand, and receiving much more attention from the opposite sex to boot.
Skin Color Does Matter
Its unfortunate but true: in Thailand, people are judged all the time based on skin tone. The whiter the skin, the more attractive, wealthy, and elite a person is perceived to be. Little wonder then that the supermarkets are filled with skin-whitening products, that many Thai girls will carry around an umbrella to block out the sun’s rays, and that Thai models are so pale they look like they haven’t been exposed to sunlight since they stopped wearing diapers. Therefore, a foreign male who gets a kick out of burning his skin to a crisp reddish brown on the islands before hitting the clubs in Bangkok shouldn’t be too surprised when Thai girls don’t give him a second glance. Of course, most Caucasian foreign guys who arrive in Thailand are pretty white to begin with, so as long as you don’t seek out the sun, you should be fine. On the other hand, African-Americans, Indians, and Arabs who arrive in Thailand will be at a distinct disadvantage in the dating arena due to their darker shade of skin.
Loose the Beer Gut
If there’s one physical feature that’s an almost universal turn-off to Thai girls, it’s a large beer belly. Of course, loosing weight is easier said than done, and poor genes or a slowing metabolism sure don’t help. Neither does the widespread availability of cheap beer in Thailand or that huge portion of bangers’n’mash at your favorite expat restaurant. However, by following a few simple tips, it can be relatively easy to stabilize your weight or even drop a few pounds in Thailand. First off, if you must drink, better stick with whiskey & soda rather than the ubiquitous beer, which is heavy in calories. Secondly, Thai eateries generally serve meals of smaller portions and fewer calories than the typical gut-busting fare of an expat restaurant, so eat local and you’ll be shedding the pounds in no time. Fitter guys appear younger, healthier, and generally more desirable to Thai girls, so control your weight and notice the difference in the attention you receive from the Thai ladies.
When All Else Fails
Some of you readers must be thinking about the time (probably numerous times) you walked down a street in Bangkok and saw an old, overweight foreigner with zero fashion sense being escorted by a beautiful Thai girl half his age. Doesn’t that scene run counter to all of the above advice? It sure does, but remember that such men are likely being escorted to the nearest jewelry shop or ATM machine in a calculated bid to slowly relieve them of their life savings. The truth is, no matter what “look” a foreign guy has or how unattractive he may be perceived by Thai girls, there will always be some uneducated girls from disadvantaged backgrounds who will be more than willing to date him provided they receive material support in return. This may be great for foreign guys who would have no chance of scoring otherwise, but also depressing for many guys who feel like they are being “used” rather than genuinely loved. However, for the foreign guys out there who are looking for a beautiful, classy Thai girl that’s genuinely interested in true romance, then take the advice in this article to heart and you may very well find the girl of your dreams in Thailand.
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Come on girls on this site Thai or not, tell the man what you look for. Don’t let wait to be told!
simple..it’s not what you say…. but DO.
btw, Im not aThai.
Interesting article. I date only farang men since I was in college. Well, Thai men seem to be a little bit too shy when they talk to me. I’m sure not all of them are that way but this is just from my experience. To me, farang men are more confident and out spoken and I like that in a man. I like when a guy can communicate and be more direct to the point. First, women are attracted to his personalities and then his appearance. Second, it’s about what he does for living and his education. Again these are based on what type of education she has and her family background. If a girl has a hard life and no education then she wouldn’t mind much about the level of her farang BF’s education. She just want a farang man(fat or thin) who can support her and her family. This is sad but true. It depends on the level of her desperation. When you meet a Thai girl who is well educated and beautiful with a great career then she usually look for a good looking-rich and well educated farang men.
The more these women date, the higher standard they have. Sad but true. I hope this give you some ideas about women.
Now you probably understand why some pretty Thai girls walking with bald, fat and unattractive farang men. I’m sure there are true love out there but under that beautiful smiles-it may mean something else more than you think.
A Thai flight attendant
Chicago, USA
…..Interesting article. I date only farang men since I was in college. Well, Thai men seem to be a little bit too shy when they talk to me. I’m sure not all of them are that way but this is just from my experience. To me, farang men are more confident and out spoken and I like that in a man. I like when a guy can communicate and be more direct to the point. First, women are attracted to his personalities and then his appearance. Second, it’s about what he does for living and his education. Again these are based on what type of education she has and her family background. If a girl has a hard life and no education then she wouldn’t mind much about the level of her farang BF’s education. She just want a farang man(fat or thin) who can support her and her family. This is sad but true. It depends on the level of her desperation. When you meet a Thai girl who is well educated and beautiful with a great career then she usually look for a good looking-rich and well educated farang men.
The more these women date, the higher standard they have. Sad but true. I hope this give you some ideas about women.
Now you probably understand why some pretty Thai girls walking with bald, fat and unattractive farang men. I’m sure there are true love out there but under that beautiful smiles-it may mean something else more than you think.
A Thai flight attendant
Chicago, USA
Eenah – Thaior not me like!
But …
it ain’t what you do, it’s the way that you do it!
Just wondering who the writer is, woman or gay guy? For most hetero guys I guess we don’t think of that stuff when dating
Hi Venita,
Hope there are more Thai ladies out there who can speak their side, could be unfair to hear from one representing the rest, I’m just considering individuality.
As a woman I can say, you have a point that some educated women would prefer educated men, I have no comment on the rest, not that I agree but because I think different way on the matters.
I also have to clarify that seems your saying that there are only two kinds of farangs, the good looking, rich and slim, and the ugly, fat and broke. The first one are educated, the latter are not.
I haven’t heard this idea until now, I’m sure some other farangs have their words on this, I’m sorry but for me this notion is totally CYNICAL.
And I have to add, do you mean if there’s this old, fat,bald, bguy with a Thai or asian lady then that lady must be a prostitute. While if the lady is with a slim and maybe young farang then the lady is EDUCATED. Wowwwoowww..amazing conclusion. ..please clarify
I don’t believe there are 2 kinds of farangs. I probably didn’t make it clear in my last post. Look is only skin deep but if we have many choices to choose. I’m sure we all want the nice-kind-good looking girl/guy. Again, I personally don’t judge someone just b/c of his appearance. Always give someone a chance is my ideal.
Anyway, I did date a not so good looking guy one time b/c I wanted to see whether he was anything different(also my mom told me that I should give the ugly one a chance). It was on for about 7 mts with no sex-I couldn’t do it and didn’t even want to kiss him. I felt like I had to put a brown bag over his head. Sorry but I hope this give you a bit more clear picture.
Eanah,
I did not mention one word about prostitution in my earlier post, how could someone interpret my post in that way?
Venita, oh sorry I misunderstood, you were pointing on the DEPERATE women who is with the UGLY men as you’ve mentioned. Please just change the” prostitute” I wrote earlier to DESPERATE. Thanks.
You have a nice day.
Eanah, it’s okay….not a big deal at all.
There are many reasons why Thai woman wants to date farangs man…
.. I have also heard that Farang man are easy to milk for cool cash in return of some nice behaviour and fake smiles. So why not to date a farang man .. nothing to loose anyway ! right girls ?
It can be money, stability, culture, love, or simply a better sex with the farang.. I heard rumours between Thai girls that farang man has the a bigger d..k compared with the Thai man and they are better in making sex…
So being a good looking, confident, funny, respectful, and romantic guy just doesn’t count anymore? Oh, I forgot, I am not rich, but I am well educated. I was very ill for the past few years, and am finally turning a corner. I am in love with a Thai woman who is very dark skinned. Does that give her less respect? She is intelligent, beautiful, funny, crazy, and irrational and I wouldn’t change a thing. I want someone who is going to be real, and be there when things are not so good, as well as on our best days. I had planned on moving to BKK for good, after my visit next week, but now I wonder?
Some interesting comments! However to be honest I think there is so much more to it or in other words its not all about sex but tmore about love.
Hmm! sorry it an old saying I’m sure but if you understand and care about the culture differences its ok and as long as both are happy thats fine.
I have now been with my ideal girl that I love and want for over a year now and although I know the culture the only thingin my mind is “does she want me” or “does she want me for my money”?
Well I know and appreciate that love is about each other and if Thai women want to fake it then fine they will get a little extra cash (maybe) but life is about happiness!
I welcome your comments.
@Diga,
It is good to be in love
and I wish you to find the real love and happiness and you desire. I can tell you one thing though.. Culture here in Thailand is very diffrent and for many girls love means financial stability and the proudness in their village to be married with a farang…. This are just my observations and I don’t contest that thai woman has feelings as well. But mostly what I have seen here is that Thai woman in general are more after financial stability offered by the men. So it is up to you to find out whether the girl love you for real …maybe you can put her to a test … althought this will be hard but at least you will find out the thruth, Good luck my friend and all the best for you. Cheers
I’m not sure, isn’t it finding a MAN is for security in general? I think it’s true to all as MEN do feed the family, it’s the role and responsibility of course that’s why a woman should find one at least who has both the ability and capability to support. And yes, that’s next to love.
Anyway, I have to make it clear that the SECURITY I’m talking about is far way different from making one as a source of income for “others”.
@GMA: If you don’t think this is how all women are hardwired then you need to do some research on evolutionary selection. On a certain level I actually like the refreshing honesty of the Thai system. Take care of my needs and I will take care of yours.
The problem in most Thai/farang relationships is in the instances where the Thai woman wants to alter the premise of the agreement. Some get greedy. Some decide to continue shopping and looking for an opportunity to trade up. Some end up being bat-shit crazy. But the reality is that this happens in farang/farang relationships too.
When a Thai woman honors her end of the bargain though, wow, they can be absolutely wonderful wives/gf’s.
Come on people, if you expect us to believe beauty is only skin deep, beauty fades, yada yada yada, they you’d think we’d believe anything.
It’s open the not so attractive woman who usually make these comments because well, chances are they would never be able to attract the handsome guy, the one with the looks.
Face it, all things being equal, if you had the chance to date a very good looking, guy, don’t pretend you wouldn’t.
@The J: Well, I agree and disagree. I don’t always go after the most attractive looking woman in the room. I’m more likely to be interested in the girl who is attractive but seems down to earth. I guess you can say I date a lot of cute girls but few that would make you drop your drink and make your tongue fall on the floor.
Even in Thailand the really sexy girls know they’re sexy and some are not too different from their farang sisters in terms of prima donna attitudes. I’ve dated both the cute and the sexy types and to some degree beauty is only skin deep.
I do agree with you on other aspects of what you wrote though.
Ruai,
Your talking after the fact, once you know they’re drama queens and the proverbial prima donnas as you put it, its quite obvious.
I mean all things being equal, we will “almost” always take the better looking girl (or guy for the ladies).
The rest is naturally subjective to what they are like once you get to know them.
@The J: No, I’m not talking after the fact. If you have any social skills whatsoever you can read people. A prima donna can be spotted a block away.
And again, I disagree. I am attracted to a personality rather than looks. Not that I don’t think a sexy girl is sexy but unless she has a good personality I’m really not interested. Call it the curse of Thailand but attractive women are everywhere so I see no need to chase after some prima donna. She’s simply not worth the effort.
I hear you, I’d say if more guys were like you, the hotties of this world would be knocked right of their little pedestals, yet you’d be amazed at how these types could be so different when the balance of power is not in their hands.
As for personality, well that only goes so far, come on, admit it, or perhaps I’m just too shallow???
@The J: Actually, I’m not amazed. I see tons of farang girls in Thailand who refuse to adjust. You should read some of the blog posts here where farang girls comment about how they can’t attract the interest of a farang guy in Thailand. Of course, none of them want to change. They don’t want to compete with the Thai women. They want it like it is back home where the guys are the ones jumping through hoops like a trained circus monkey for the privilege of buying them drinks or dinner.
I work with a very freindly Northern Thai girl, so freindly and always smiling! So nice that i think im falling in love with her. Are all Thai girls like this? This girl is a software support engineer, and even so, she is not up their in the clouds, just a normal down to earth girl. She has short hair, and quite attractive.
@Peter
If you are wondering if all Thai girls are so friendly and always smilimg, then the answer is no. But yes, Thai girls are like that because we grew up in a culture that teaches us to be that way. Good luck with your potential love.
@Dariya: Great answer!
@Peter: Thai people are as varied as any other people. The first lesson (and maybe the most important) to learn in Thailand is that there are no “Thai people” or “Thai girls” or “Thai guys” anymore than there are “American people” or “British people” or “French people.” You rob someone of their individuality by turning them into a stereotype.
That being said, as Dariya points out Thai culture may promote certain behaviors or attributes. Being friendly and charming is something that many Thais aspire to. That doesn’t mean that every Thai is friendly and charming though just as there are people in every culture who do not fit into the values that their culture promotes.
Most thai women expect financial support from a farang man, it’s just a reality of their culture and economic situation. If a guy expects to get laid or get a girlfriend on his looks alone he is likely to be disappointed. Not that looks don’t count, in fact they count for a lot – a good looking guy can expect to get a higher quality girl while paying a lot less, though he does have to come up with a minimum amount so a girl can at least keep face with her relatives and peers. There are however two exceptions: A good looking youngish and fit guy who has pure blonde hair and blue eyes. There is something about that pure Aryan look that turns 3rd world women into bitches in heat, don’t know exactly what it is but if you are one of those guys – expect to get laid very cheaply or even for free. the other guy is a good looking youngish and fit guy who looks basically caucasian but has just a little bit of asian ancestry. This looks exotic to Thai (and other asian women) girls and not only excites them greatly but makes a man more acceptable socially, a guy like that will get a lot of Thai girls who might not be inclined to date a white guy. You’re not really white because yo have some asian in you! I had a friend who had 1/4 asian blood, looked white but had a hint of asian in him, his dance card was always packed and he barely had to make an effort. Note: it doesn’t work with asian looking guys with just a little caucasian in them. I didn’t see many of those types of guys in my many years in thailand, that pure Aryan look or the exotic mixed race look really isn’t that common so guys like that are rare enough to continue to be novel with thai girls. This might seem unfair to guys that don’t have those natural advantages but life isn’t always fair.
@ Jerryd
As a Thai girl in her mid-twenties, I’d like to reply to your comment. Let’s start with some common ground. Yes, many Thai women do expect financial support from a man, much as many Western women expect the man to be the main breadwinner. Sadly, Thai women come from a culture in which a dowry is expected and where parents can seriously influence a woman’s choices for marriage. The majority of Thai women also come from a background of poverty or relative poverty. This means that many go and sell themselves for sex, even to perverts, even at the risk of physical violence or rough sex leading to anal sex, hospitalization and HIV infection, all because they wish to support their father and mother. It seems quite obvious that marrying into wealth (common in Western countries with the ‘trophy wives’ of footballers or good time gals with their sugar daddies springing to mind) presents a good alternative to poverty or sex slavery. This obviously depresses the opportunities for real love based on friendship, mutual intellectual attraction and what the hell, the desire to go at it like a train with someone. The ‘second-class’ status of Thai women compared to men (also common in Western countries) is a further complicating factor because Thai women are not supposed to go out socially with the aim of having fun with a man. But, for a Thai woman, it isn’t really the color of your hair or eyes that makes the difference, though for the majority of Westerners, a blonde with big tits and a tight ass may be the be all and end all (or maybe you prefer small Asian girls the size of Western pre-teens?). Instead, we just want someone we can take home to our mothers and be proud of, someone who is a good father, someone who will love us, and yes, if they are wealthier or the main breadwinner, someone who will provide us with opportunities to fulfill our potential in life, like by supporting us to study an MA. Maybe you’re someone like that, maybe not. But every time you refer stereotypically to ’3rd world Asian women’ being like “Bitches in Heat”, you’re helping to promulgate a distinctly warped worldview that shouldn’t be endorsed by someone who can write in whole sentences and spell correctly. Maybe then you might help to make life a little bit fairer. Think before you type before you post – are YOU part of the problem or part of the solution? (and by the way, this is a rhetorical question)
First of all, I must compliment you on your mastery of English and your ability to express concepts from a Western viewpoint. If you hadn’t qualified yourself as a Thai woman I would have sworn you were an embittered angry western feminist! However, that’s the only positive thing I can write about your post. What exactly is your issue with what I wrote? Was I inaccurate? Did you simply not like my honesty and frankness? Please explain. Your posting was basically a personal attack and a lot of insinuations rather than a coherent and cogent response to what I had written. What exactly was your point? You imply that I don’t understand the economic and cultural issues Thai women are dealing with. I did point out that out, perhaps not in the detail you did but that doesn’t mean I don’t understand them. Lets see, if you go through a long detailed explanation of the poverty and low pay they are confronted with it makes me look like I don’t know anything and am uncaring and ignorant. Nice try, but only the stupid and weak minded will fall for that.
Are you saying that Thai girls would never “go at it like a train” with a guy…under any circumstances…ever??? I agree that their society seriously suppresses the desire to do so (but I clearly pointed that out – DIDN’T I??? So why the long winded attempt to make it sound like I don’t realize that????)
Aren’t Thai women basically as human as any other women? As suppressed as they may be they still have their secret desires, sure those desires are most likely meeting someone with a lot of money but maybe sometimes they just want to have fun and will let if fly a little. I did point out that “regular, decent to good looking” guys can’t expect to get any free action from Thai girls (at least not on a regular basis). It generally is going to require a guy who fits an idealized image. Don’t believe me? Find a good looking blonde hair blue eyed Brad Pitt type and shop him around some Thai ladies. OK, maybe not all of them will give up any free action but there are ones that will, and those ones that are inclined to do so – he’s gonna be the guy they do it with. How do I know? I’VE SEEN IT!!! If you disagree with that – SAY SO DIRECTLY! Don’t skirt around with long winded attempts to make me sound like I’m full of it – BE SPECIFIC!
You seem to have taken offense at my “bitches in heat” comment. OK, but it’s not jut 3rd world women, I apply that to all women (now you can really trash my chauvinism), because when women get around a JFK or Brad Pitt looking guy they pretty much respond the same way, and you know what I’m talking about. Since I am only a “regular’ looking guy I am well aware of the effect extremely good looking guys have on women. Yes, I am envious (anticipating the next attack, you will of course accuse me of jealousy to make me look negative), but that’s natural for anyone to feel that way. However, I do not carry jealousy around and let it fester, sure I have felt put out when women tune me out for a very good looking guy without bothering to find out I might be a pretty good guy in my own right. You as a woman may have felt angry when men ignore you to chase after better looking women. The key to having balanced perspective is understanding there are two sides to the coin and that sometimes life is unfair whether you’re a man or a woman and you simply have to suck it up and move on. Sometimes some people are luckier than others, heck it’s better to be lucky than good, fair or not it’s the way life is. I do admit to not being perfect and perhaps the “bitches in heat” comment was written with the memory of hanging out in Thai bars with a couple of buddies, one of whom was that “idealized blonde type”, seeing him swarmed with women and knowing that some of those women would actually do him for free or next to nothing, and also knowing that was not going to happen to me. So shoot me. I’m sure you’ve made “male bashing” comment to your girlfriends that aren’t any better or any more justified.
Also, your stereotyping of Asian girls being as small as preteens was a bizarre comment for a “Thai woman” to make. In my years in Thailand I never heard a Thai women speak that way about themselves. Western women however seem obsessed with it. Hmmm…You sure don’t sound like any Thai woman I’ve known. I swear to god you must be channeling the soul of some Western woman. Personally I don’t think of Thai women as all being “small as preteens”, yes on average their a bit shorter and a few lbs. lighter but in my mind they are as mature and womanly as any American lady I’ve been with.
In closing I have a very important piece of advice for you. DO NOT EVER IMPLY OR INSINUATE THAT SOMEONE IS A PEDOPHILE. You will of course whine that you never did that – but you did. This comment: (or maybe you prefer small Asian girls the size of Western pre-teens?). was a non sequitur designed to suggest something about me that was never implied or stated in any way by anything I wrote. You simply pulled that out of your hat in order to make me look like a pervert and discredit me, anyone who doubts that please read the previous post. In the minds of many in our society an insinuation is very close to an accusation and an accusation is equivalent to guilt. You know this and that’s why you said it. Let me explain something: Someone who makes a false accusation of child abuse is as bad as someone who commits the crime. False accusations create a safety screen for real perpetrators to hide behind – those that help create those screens are no less responsible. I suggest you subscribe to your own advice: THINK BEFORE YOU TYPE BEFORE YOU POST.
@ Jerryd,
Well thank you for taking your time to explain your point. I have my opinion and you yours. I’ll just leave it that way.
@Jerryd,
Sorry, have only a couple things to add: after carefully reading both of our comments, I must that I’m sorry that you think I tried to make you look like a pedophile. If you’d like to take it that way, then I have nothing else to say. I mean you already expected this to be just my excuse anyway. (“You will of course whine that you never did that – but you did.”)
And another point: if I don’t agree with you using offensive words like bitches in heat, say why many Thai women choose to marry to wealth, and find a common ground between 2 cultures, then I’m probably an angry feminist? Maybe I am. And I just really don’t understand why there’s a need to criticize by calling people bad names. I know no one likes it.
I do not wish to start an online debate. I did think hard before I posted because I was afriad that something like this might be your reaction. Well, my apology for interfering.
Dude! what you said is not even the point. You go around calling women bitches because you envy the so-called mr. Brad Pitt for getting their attention. LOL You are pathetic, man. I feel sorry for you.
Jerryd
LOL! Agree with everything you say! Nothing wrong with honest talk about some of the junk that goes on between guys and gals. scary stuff for some people.
That lady is definitely a bitter over the hill American broad. Who’s she think she’s kidding?
Hey Anthony
“HOW” was I missing the point exactly? Please explain. Can you even tell me what the “point” was? Do you even have the wit to debate above a fifth grade level?
I’m pathetic? Why, because I spoke too honestly about something? Didn’t like my choice of words? OK, so my metaphor was a little lowbrow, but don’t worry I’m an equal opportunity insulter: Megan Fox walks in a room and every man will turn into a bitch in heat. Doesn’t sound so bad when it’s men. Right? A lot of women in that room will mutter similar things to each other but won’t get trashed for it.
Are you one of those “Brad Pitt looking guys”? Unless you are there have been times you’ve been aced out by better looking guys and felt a bit of envy and frustration. There isn’t a guy in the world (unless he’s one of “those guys”) who hasn’t felt that at one time or the other, except for you, of course. YOU sir, are the one exception! which means you can pass judgment on me. That’s sarcasm by the way. You know S-A-R-C-A-S-M.
Now take a moment and think about all that (concentrate)….Is it dawning on you that judging me is a wee bit hypocritical?
I give dariya credit for at least having some intellience…she’s just being disingenuous. You…”Dude” on the other hand just sound stupid. If you’re not, then post something that proves it.
@Marco: I have met Dariya and can attest that she is Thai. She’s also very intelligent and very witty. She’s also not a knee-jerk defender of everything Thai and is quite honest and open about the positives and negatives of Thai culture.
@jerryd: Yes, you are lowbrow. And offensive. And narrow minded.
I’m not sure what sort of self esteem issue causes you to fixate on Brad Pitt but all you’re saying is good looking guys have more romantic options than ugly ones. Duh! Water is wet. What does that have to do with anything?
And no, not all Thai women like blond hair and blue eyes. Not anymore than all farang men like girls with blond hair and blue eyes. Some like Latinas. Some like redheads. Some like Asians.
Most of your comments start off with a fragment of truth but then you pontificate a heap of racist nonsense on top and then grasp onto that one truthful fragment as your evidence for the nonsense. You seem to have mastered the art of bullying debate so I can guess that you have a lot of experience supporting your viewpoints when normal logic fails.
To Jerryd:
I’d say “angry feminist” is rather redundant, because most feminists are indeed angry about the situation of women throughout the world. All activism is spurred by anger. However, most feminists are pretty good at controlling those feelings of anger. Feminism has never killed anybody, while machos kill innumerable women every single day.
The men who try to make feminism a dirty word are the ones that fear the world it seeks to promote: one where all women’s dignity is preserved and protected. And sure, most feminists are ready to become really angry with those people who publicly attack women. They will raise their voice as loud as needed to say NO to oppression and violence against women.
Feminism is a beautiful and peaceful movement, one of solidarity among women and towards men. One that seeks justice for our daughters and sons. And until that world of gender equality and respect is achieved, you can bet that feminists will be angry.
Blond and blue eyes? It’s okay if you’re good looking, but it’s MUCH better to be dark haired and dark eyed.
Thais are not like Westerners – Thais don’t make a fetish of the different and the exotic but prefer what lies closest to home. Combine that with a generally timid and conservative personality slightly fearful and suspicious of the different and unusual (Thais are a fearful people, not bold, like Westerners), and it’s easy to see why blond and blue eyed doesn’t go over so well in Thailand.
Generally, the guys who go down best in Thailand are…..wait for it, the ones who look most like hi-so Thais or Asians! That means slightly caucasian facial features attached to a thin, not too tall body, black hair, dark eyes, pale skin – you know the package.
I’m blond and once dyed my hair black for kicks – it ended up making me more popular with Thai chics!
@ Karl
You’re partly correct. Something that is too exotic is indeed scary, but on the other hand, something which is too familiar is boring. If all Thai girls were afraid of something exotic, then Thai-Farang relationships simply wouldn’t exist. Rather, its the BLEND of the familiar with the exotic which is most compelling. That’s why so models in Thailand are mixed race: they have some familiar Thai feautures, but also have exotic Western features as well.
To: Ruai
Did you even read my posting? If so, why the lack of comprehension – Go back and carefully reread what was posted and think about it carefully. You will note that my first posting simply pointed out that men of certain physical types can do better than other men. It was pertinent to the discussion and I wasn’t making a big deal out of it just saying it. It was your pal Dariya that became upset and decided to chastise me. Let’s be clear about this: It was not my “chauvinistic” choice of words she was reacting to (reread her response), it was that I was pointing out some truths in female behavior. Namely that women can be as shallow as men when it comes to choosing a partner (IE: Good looking guys have more romantic options – Duh!) THAT’S why she went on a long rant about how women only judge by “higher” qualities. What a bunch of crap. Not that physical attraction is the only thing that women (or men) are attracted to, of course it’s more complex than that but her attempt to portray women as “saintly” and “only” look for deeper qualities was promoting an absurd myth that many women cling to and defend with every ounce of their beings. What’s amusing about your response is that you are agreeing with “gasp”… ME! That’s exactly the opinion that you’re buddy Dariya overreacted to. Maybe you and she should start arguing with each other. My discussion of this subject is only in response to her accusatory and angry response, not an attempt to over explain an obvious concept. You try to make me sound stupid but you’re the one doesn’t comprehend what’s going on. Unbelievable. I’m wondering if you aren’t much smarter than that moron Anthony.
On top of your abysmally stupid attack you make another ridiculous accusation. Racism???? How am I racist? What was racist? You offer no explanation of course. Just make the accusation. Much like Dariya made her “insinuation/accusation” that I am some sort of pervert. No reason given, just pulled out of nowhere. This bears repeating: These accusations are designed to discredit me and manipulate weak minded people. We live in a society that has fostered an environment in which these accusations are the equivalent of guilt. If you are accused the suspicion is planted and many people will believe you are guilty.
Both you (Ruai) and Dariya know this well. That is why you did it. The gullible will read the accusation and not bother to read back and actually understand what is going on. You both understand on some level the weakness of your positions so you resort to ad hominem tactics. At least if I point out your stupidity it’s based on something and I support what I say.
This also bears repeating: People suffer every day from racism and sexual abuse. Any person who would exploit that suffering to win a petty argument is not much better than any degenerate that actually commit these evils. You – Ruai and Dariya help create a screen that perpetrators hide behind. To help protect monsters like these is disgusting and immoral.
To: “S”
I don’t disagree with feminism in general. I support most feminist goals and ideas. I also think feminists should be angry, there’s a lot to be angry about, but direct the anger toward legitimate targets. My comment about angry feminist was in regards to the lack of perspective of a certain poster. She took offense to my stating a simple human truth and made a baseless accusation, much the way an angry feminist who lacks perspective would. When I say lacks perspective I mean that many feminists cannot comprehend that women are as flawed and faulty in their own ways as men are. To even mention this concept you will get an avalanche of rage and anger from feminists who try to mythologize the feminine and blame men for everything bad. Many feminists also intermingle their own personal issues toward men in their feminist philosophy and pretend that it’s political. It’s unfortunate because a movement that should be inclusive becomes more divisive than it should be.
@jerryd: No, I accused of being racist because you are. As I told you in a previous post the moment you start off a sentence with “Thai people are …” you’re already wrong. Thais are as varied as anybody else. To say – in no uncertain terms – that Thais prefer this or that is as ignorant as saying all Irish like red hair and freckles.
Others have been pointing out the same issue to you too. Your fantasy that only blonde haired, blue eyed Arians are attractive to Thais only cements the proof you have no idea what you’re talking about.
And the way you try to ward off a response by creating a strawman counter argument signals to me that you spend a lot of time engaging in online pissing contests. So I know the game you’re playing. You’re trying to deflect your original racist comments by finding some minutia to hide behind while you debate semantics. Just address you original racist comment that all Thais . . .
Did you even READ my postings?????
If you want to prove you don’t have a comprehension problem then prove it!!!!
I’m a racist for making absolute stereotypes???? WHERE did I do that?????
I CLEARLY POINTED OUT, WELL BEFORE YOU STARTED DEMONSTRATING YOUR IGNORANCE, THAT I DON’T BELIEVE THAT ALL THAI WOMEN IDEALIZE THE BLONDE HAIR BLUE YED TYPE!!!
REREAD my postings!!!! THINK about what you read!!!!
Do you have some psychosis that compels you to utterly ignore what I’ve actually written and then fabricate untruths???
Do you think people on this thread are so stupid they can’t read and won’t realize that you are ignoring and/or contradicting things I have said?
Many people will comment on what they have experienced. Many people won’t necessarily have actually had a friend who fit that “ideal nordic” type and hung with him in Thai bars. I have. I’ve seen what happens. If someone has experienced something different, that’s fine, I can respect that.
Now how about being specific. WHAT did I say that was racist? HOW was it racist?
Is ALL you have is accusations?????? You never explain how anything I say is racist. You never specify any statements??? Are you ever going to do that???
Note when you reread the original postings that started this little brouhaha that your pal Dariya made the first “strawman” counter argument. Another little factoid (among many) you just didn’t “notice”. She’s the one that started with the personal attacks instead of commenting on what I actually said. You, of course, have continued with the same.
It’s not unusual for people of another culture or race to idealize people who have slightly different features. You could say that american men idealize the blonde hair nordic females or american women idealize tall dark latin types. Blonde hair blue eyed types command top dollar in the modeling industry in Japan, both men and women. Of course, not every Japanese or american fetishizes a certain physical type. Had to throw that in so you don’t “accuse” me of making an absolute statement. Of course you’ll still throw in a racist accusation – RIGHT??? How is commenting on something that is real racist??? Certain physical types could be more succesful with the opposite sex if they appear to be exotic. It happens. That’s all my comments boiled down to. Nothing more nothing less. How is that racist???? BE SPECIFIC!
By the way, how am I finding some minutia to hide behind while I debate semantics? Hey, that really sounds cool. Somebody might actually be fooled into thinking you know what you’re talking about.
The following is a repost – I will continue to repost this every time you make your BS accusations:
Both you (Ruai) and Dariya know this well. That is why you did it. The gullible will read the accusation and not bother to read back and actually understand what is going on. You both understand on some level the weakness of your positions so you resort to ad hominem tactics. At least if I point out your stupidity it’s based on something and I support what I say.
This also bears repeating: People suffer every day from racism and sexual abuse. Any person who would exploit that suffering to win a petty argument is not much better than any degenerate that actually commit these evils. You – Ruai and Dariya help create a screen that perpetrators hide behind. To help protect monsters like these is disgusting and immoral.
@jerryd: There are no “ad hominem” attacks. If you want quotes, here you go
There is something about that pure Aryan look that turns 3rd world women into bitches in heat
Listen, I have plenty of Aryan looking friends and they get no more or less attention than their similarly attractive dark haired brothers. I’ve never seen a Thai, Cambodian, Indian, Chinese, African, Latin American, or Eastern European woman become a bitch in heat simply because someone has blond hair and blue eyes.
If you take an 8 looking dark haired guy and a 6 Aryan looking guy the dark haired guy will always win, all other things being equal (friendliness, attitude, etc). To suggest that women in third world countries get all hot and bothered based solely on something like hair and eye color is not only racist, it’s insulting to anyone with an IQ in the triple digits.
And your comments about Thai women only being interested in money are similarly racist, offensive, and ignorant.
Most thai women expect financial support from a farang man, it’s just a reality of their culture and economic situation. If a guy expects to get laid or get a girlfriend on his looks alone he is likely to be disappointed.
The part you failed to include is that Thai women are, generally, looking for someone who can provide for them just like any woman anywhere in the world expects a husband to. Dead broke losers have trouble getting women all over the world so why did you single out Thailand?
52% of the population is female. Weed out the ladyboys, gays, yaba heads, and other undesirables from the dating pool and you’re looking at about 10% of all the women in the country have nothing to look forward to but 50 or so years working 12 hours a day 6 days a week. So yeah, most are looking to hook up with a guy who can earn enough to support a family. They have less options so they look at every relationship as possible marriage material. Just like lots of women anywhere else in the world. Except since the average wage in Thailand for Thais is about 10,000 baht ($300 USD) per month you don’t exactly have to be rich to be able to put food on the table.
The only real difference is the sin sod. But that is a cultural thing that is slowly losing importance and is often just ceremonial with the parents giving the money back after the wedding.
Personally, I’ve never given a gf a single baht. I buy meals, pay for things when we go out, and buy gifts just like I would if I was dating back home but I’ve never paid for any sick buffalos, operations for sick relatives, or anything like that. In fact, I’ve never even been asked by a real gf. Sure you get crazy girls from dating sites and all but no girl I’ve ever been serious with has even asked for money.
So all of this rubbish about needing money or looking Aryan is just nonsense. The rules here are the same as back home. Good looking guys – regardless of hair color – will always get more female attention than uglier guys. Women will always want a man that can financially support a family. So what exactly is the point you’re trying to make?
You make these inflammatory and incorrect statements and when a real life Thai woman tells you what Thai people think you tell her that she’s wrong. I guess you know what gets a Thai girl hot better than a Thai girl? This is why it’s pointless to even attempt to debate you. When confronted with differing opinions – even from people who obviously have greater insight than you – you resort to playing games to avoid the possibility you might have a wrong perception born out of only having a narrow view of a particular situation.
ruai – The guy may be wrong, but why this attempt at politically correct bullying? National culture and ethnic cultures really do differ on a wide variety of attitudes, and it is in no way wrong to try to describe the core common perceptions and attitudes of any particular group or culture, and trying to stigmatize that is the kind of PC bullshit lots of guys come to Thailand to get away from.
Stop using shaming language like accusations of racism simply because someone disagrees with you. If someone is wrong in his points, he is wrong in his points – when someone else brings up supposed moral infractions as the center of the debate, that:s just creepy.
Moralizing is slimy, a little more intellectual decency would be cool.
And just because one particular Thai girl makes comments about her culture, that need not be treated as gospel – how many Western people can accurately describe and interpret Western culture in a way that would command universal agreement from all other Westerners? None. Members of a particular culture are more often than not blinded by their participation in that culture and by a desire – subconscious or not – to present it in a particular light.
Any Thai person *explaining* aspects of Thai culture should be received with politeness and open minded interest, but with a healthy dose of sekepticism as well. A Thai persons view is just one more interesting thing to be considered and is no more authoritative than a foreigners view, who may well see things more clearly. It just depends. No one, not Thai or foreigner, has any claim to any special authority on things Thai.
I am really opposed to what has become the common practice of trotting out some Thai person who *explains* some aspect of Thailand and then assuming this Thai person couldnt possibly have any agenda or myopia about his own culture – come on, we all know people from our own cultures whose ideas we think are completely crazy.
I enjoy your comments, which are always well organized and interesting, but it would be even better if you left out the moralizing and thought a little more deeply on what standards you use to evaluate arguments.
@Kelley: I’m not sure I fully understand your comment. Mostly because I really don’t feel I’m moralizing. Some things are simply racist. Saying women in third world countries get hot like bitches in heat for blond haired, blue eyed men is … well, racist. I’m not trying to enforce some PC agenda. I’m merely pointing out a fact.
I fully understand – and am often guilty of – using phrases like Thais do, Thais think, or Thais are. But that was not the racism I was pointing out. His was not a generalization but a series of ignorant accusations.
I would agree with your POV if he said that Thais hate Indian food and I claimed he was being racist because I know a Thai that likes nan. But his statements are very different because they infer derogatory things about Thais. When you state in no uncertain terms that the only way you can get laid in Thailand is by giving her money that pretty much is saying all Thais are whores. That is racist and I really don’t feel that pointing it out is being overly PC.
Nor do I feel as if I’m putting forth a Thai as the expert on all things Thailand. On the other hand, as a Thai, as a woman, I think it would be absolutely retarded not to take her opinion on what is attractive to Thai women seriously. Now if we were talking about sin sod, corruption, dual pricing or a host of other issues I would take her input as a single data point of many but when you’re talking about what a person thinks … that person tends to be more authoritative.
Ruai – your last point first. I think it would be retarded to take a womans opinion – Thai or otherwise – seriously when trying to figure out what women want in men. Women have no clue what they want in men. Women also have an *official* view about what they SHOULD want in men that keeps them from telling the truth about what they actually want with men. Women often say they want nice guys, yet never actually choose nice guys. Funny that.
I dont blame you for thinking its best to consult a woman on what women find attractive. Its natural and most guys think that way, but most guys need to stop thinking that way. A particular woman MIGHT know what is attractive to woman as a whole, but it is a fact that women per se simply cannot be treated as authorities on what turns them on. Men have to learn this the hard way.
If you want to know what turns women on, dont ask a woman, who usually has no clue or will no peddle what she thinks she SHOULD be saying to seem like a nice girl – to think women have no conscious or unconscious agenda in showing themselves in a particular light, often as better than they are is hugely naive and disastrous if you want to get at the truth – rather, ask a man who is successful with women. Hes cracked the code and knows.
As for the racism bit, think about what you are saying. You are saying that we are only allowed to say nice things about a group. Anything negative is wrong. Thats surely nuts. How can you not see that? I can think of a dozen good and bad things to say about Thais as a group. In your world view, I am only permitted to say the nice things? In a word – no. Surely anyone rational can see thats nuts.
Or are you saying that we cannot say anything about a group at all, nice or mean? That we cant discuss groups because *everyone is an individual*? That is intellectually indefensible. It is an indisputable fact that one CAN generalize about groups. Of course one must bear in mind that there are always exceptions and no generalization applies to every group, but statements like *most Thais*, or *most English people* certainly CAN be very, very true. I myself can think of any number of statements off the top of my head about *most English people* like, say, *most English people believe in democracy*. But according to you we cant make statements like that about groups?
Surely anyone rational can see how wrong that is.
@Kelley: Actually I’m not saying any of that. What I am saying is that making such sweeping generalizations based on a very limited view is racist. What if I were to say all British are drunk football hooligans? Or all Americans are war crazed nationalists?
There’s a post somewhere on here about generalizing good and bad Thai girls which is an excellent primer for this discussion. There are so many slices within those groups. The commenter sounded like your typical farang who only knows the country from what he’s seen on lower Suk or Walking Street.
And while I hear you a bit on what women want we’re talking about physical attributes. A girl does know if she likes blond hair enough that simply the sight of a blond haired farang turns her into a bitch in heat. Plus one can confirm this through simple observation. Most of the guys I know who regularly get dates with very attractive Thai women have dark hair. There are a few blonds who can do the same but both blonds and dark haired successful guys also happen to be very good looking regardless of where they are in the world. Ugly Aryans don’t get girls any easier than ugly dark haired guys.
Imo. my personal experience on what Thai girls like and dont like physically in western men:
Like Long/Semi long hair or at least a hair cut (does not like very short hair)
Slim is more important than muscular
Pretty/good looking over Masculine/rugged
Height not really that important
Dress ‘handsome’ in shirt, nice jeans/slacks, nice shoes. Does not like casual, niche or other dress that could indicate non-conformist.
So, I actually agree with the premise of this article.
Come on guys, take a look around Thai society. Thailand is VERY conservative. All guys and girls dress the same. I mean, you can go to a club and not one person will stand out, just an endless barrage of the same shirt/jeans for guys and short dress/short shorts for girls. I don’t mind that, but it says something.
Thai girls like the classicaly handsome guy. The good guy in soaps, always dressed in a shirt, with a nice “grown up” haircut. He’d be seen as boring in the West. He’s also light skinned.
The bad guys on the other hand are darker, have very short hair and wear t-shirts.
I think Thai women (and men) feel threatened by western notions of masculinity, simply because they see very little western style ‘machismo’ in their daily life. That’s why they go for the non-threathening, slightly feminine farang who reminds them of their slightly feminine Thai boyfriends. In other words, they may very well associate western notions of masculinity with violence or crime.
Though, I think the basic attraction switches are no different for Thai women. Put them in a more open and less restricted enviroment (such as a western vacation) and I think they’d go for more ‘macho’.
In short, handsome is more important than macho.
Ruai – you seem not to have challenged my description of your position but rather to have affirmed it – once again, you say one cant make negative generalizations about a group.
It is absurd to claim – as you seem to be doing – that all societies, seemingly by definition, are divided into precisely equal parts on all issues in so that you cant say anything about the *majority*. That is obviously false. Societies do indeed have majorities that are united by commonalities, and you need to understand these commonalities in order to understand the culture.
All one needs to do is keep in mind that any generalization has exceptions – Im sure Jerryd accepts that his descirption doesnt apply to ALL Thais, only most.
As for your other point, that negative generalizations are necessarily *racist* – again, for reasons already provided, an intellectually indefensible position.
Once one accepts the legitimacy of genarlizations – with a healthy grasp of their limitations, i.e they dont capture exceptions – one cannot restrict generalizations only to the positive.
You see, Ruai, you are suffering from typical PC think – twisting your thinking into illogical loops in order to satisfy some sense of morality that is at variance with the facts.
I happen to agree that Jerryd is hopelessly wrong on the blonde thing, but it isnt in any way racist. Im sure hed agree that not ALL thais are that way, only perhaps most.
As for women – I tend not to trust anything they say on the topic of their own sexual attraction, even on something as simple as physical characteristic. I agree Jerryd is wrong, but not because some Thai women said Thai chics arent into blonde hair – that is almost irrelevant as evidence.
@Kellie: Again you are attempting to misread what I wrote. I have not said that there might not be a majority in a country but if 51% of Germans have farts that smell like roses the correct way to phrase that is “Most Germans have farts that smell like roses,” not “All Germans . . .”
There are all types of ways to make comparative statements. Like recently a study found that the average Thai only reads two books per year compared to 60 in Vietnam and 45 in Singapore. Personally, I think the implications of that are a very negative statement about Thai society.
So you can say positive and negative things in a general sense but not label an entire race or nationality.
And no, I don’t accept that jerryd intended to make the distinction as he lumped all third world countries (in itself an incorrect label for Thailand) and not once ever attempted to limit his remarks to a majority in any response even when told that not all Thais (or even a majority) fit his description.
So why do you presume to know what jerryd meant? He had plenty of opportunity to explain himself but instead reinforced his global position that Aryans turn Thai women into bitches in heat.
For instance:
You seem to have taken offense at my “bitches in heat” comment. OK, but it’s not jut 3rd world women, I apply that to all women (now you can really trash my chauvinism), because when women get around a JFK or Brad Pitt looking guy they pretty much respond the same way, and you know what I’m talking about. Since I am only a “regular’ looking guy I am well aware of the effect extremely good looking guys have on women.
Now the funny part being jerryd kept talking about the Aryan look which is pale white skin, blue eyes, and very blond hair . . . yet one of his two examples clearly doesn’t fit the definition. JFK had reddish brown hair and his eyes where greenish-gray. And technically Pitt’s dirty blond roots might disqualify him as well but I’ll give him that one.
But what was my response to that? That Thai women are attracted to attractive men and not just Aryans. Yet in every response he tried to peg third world women to getting all hot and bothered only by the Aryan look (or the elusive part Asian part Aryan).
It’s like saying all white guys are into Asian girls. Obviously some are but is it the majority? I know many guys who absolutely detest Asian looking women. Or does it mean that a guy who prefers Asian women also prefers ugly Asian women?
The biggest problem I have/had with jerryd’s comments is that he presents everything he says as fact. He makes sweeping generalizations about races, cultures (according to him all Thai women require money before sleeping with you unless you are Aryan), and even economic status and then puts forth some anecdotal evidence (in this case that he can’t get laid without paying while his Aryan friends can) as defacto proof for his position.
And on your increasingly frequent assertion that I am PC . . . I am anything but. I can guarantee you that I hold some of the most un-PC ideas out there. I can assure you that if accused me of being PC in front of my friends they would double over in laughter.