First, let me introduce myself : I am a Thai person. I have read a lot of Farangs’ stories about Thai bar girls and I am disturbed by them. Your stories are quite similar. You stated that Oh, I met this girl, that girl in a bar and I fell in love with her. I took her to my country and gave her a good new life. I gave her lots of lots of money but she ran away from me after all. I spent such money 50,000 – 300,000 dollars and look how she treated me back. Once she settled in my country she ran away with another guy blah blah blah. I feel hurt without a doubt. Why are Thai girls so… bad why do they have to be like that ? They are scam artists, they never loved me in the first place and I found out later. No, no…no… the truth of the matter is you did not find out later, you knew right from the beginning!
I know exactly what you meant, and I can understand why you are so angry and hurt. However, come on, you guys all know from the get go that they are bar girls, they are prostitutes! What makes you think that they will leave their country to go with you without anything in it for them? Come on, you are not that naive and you were not born yesterday. You knew that they are all after your money.
I think we all know that you were in love, or infatuated with them. If you choose to marry a prostitute, that is your prerogative. But, don’t come crying later that oh, Thai girls are bad, deceitful, unfaithful. As a matter of fact, you are not talking about Thai girls at all, you are talking about prostitutes that happened to be Thai. I know in your country, it is not a big deal, and I understand that. In Thailand, it is a big deal. Honourable Thai men with good status in society never marry them. In our country we have like a hierarchy which is hidden in Thai society, even though it is not obvious like in India. Well, it will probably take me forever to explain to you.
A lot of you are around 50 – 65 years of age, and you mess around with Thai bar girls who are around 20 – 30 years old. Some of you said you spent money on them, 100,000 dollars or more, and I believe you…how’s that? I am not sure whether you have a big heart, or a small brain. Let’s not dance, shall we? Everybody knows that you guys all go there for one main reason, and that is sex. You went there, you had a good time, and you left your heart over there. Then you think about taking these girls to your country. You think you can change them, you want to provide them a better life…well that is very nice of you. However, they may never change, but you just hope and one thing that I can guarantee you is that you can never buy…love.
It is inconceivable to me how someone at your age could be such a complete idiot! I am sorry to be mean, but it disturbs me badly when someone defrauds someone like that. I am sure there must be some doubt in your mind as well whether the girl is with you for money or not, right? But, you still went for it because you loved (were infatuated) with a bar girl.
Oh no, please do not get me wrong, I do not approve of my compatriot’s conduct at all. I think it is wrong and shameful to take advantage of someone who falls in love with you like that. It is bad and deplorable and I sympathise with you. However, you have to accept some responsibilities as well.
You knew exactly from the outset who they were, but you still went for them anyhow…so don’t you think you are partially responsible for the consequences as well? Maybe you are the one who deceived yourself, maybe you like to live in a fantasy world? I know sometimes it is happier to live in a fantasy world than the real world. Don’t you think this is the time to come out and face reality? Well, I know I have been very cruel to your feelings, but if I don’t make a strong comment to you, you will never understand or get my picture, my message or whatever. I am sorry if I offend anyone, o.k?
Here is my second part and here is my advice: If you really love a Thai girl and want to marry her, you should go for a real Thai girl. I mean a Thai girl with education who has a real job, not a bar girl. I know it is more difficult, but they are still out there. If you want a happy married life, then you must find a way and a will to locate her. You know,… right, easy come, easy go, difficult come, difficult go. Well some of you might say that there are some people who have a happy marriage with a former bar girl. Yes, there are about 2%, but you are not 2%…you are the other 98%.
If you live in your country, maybe you can find a Thai girl who is already there to save all kind of hassle. You can find her through a college or university. A lot of Thai people study over there (the states, England, Australia, New Zealand, Canada.) Or perhaps she works in a Thai restaurant. Well, I am sure if you can find the way to go to Thailand for those bar girls then you can find the way to figure that out too. In those countries that I mentioned above, they all have Thai communities. Maybe, you can visit their website and leave your message on their web board. Your message should be clear and truthful about what you are looking for. Who knows what might happen after that? Let’ s hope for the best. You see, you don’t even have to go to Thailand to find her, maybe she is right next door to you.
I apologize once again if I offend anyone with my strong comment. I hope you guys learn something from my point of view.
Good luck to all of you, and take care.
From a Thai person who lives abroad.
Excellent, informative article. The words, “easy
come, easy go, difficult come, difficult go.”
explain very much very succinctly. It also points out the difference between “difficult” and “hard”.
Teaching English to a Thai student at university in Australia, she helped me understand that while
forged steel is “hard”, calculus is not “hard”. Calculus is “difficult”. Us farang might think that learning to speak pasa Thai is “hard”, while a Thai speaker might find some of the nuances of English “difficult”. Either way is the same, although the tone marks in Thai define “dog” from “come”, while in English, the context is the key.
Thanks for the essay, Non Ja. I’d like to see that axiom written on the walls of the arrivals counters at Suvarnabhumi in English, and in pasa Thai at the departures lounge.
I’m right with you. What do people who marry bargirls expect?
Always good to hear things from a Thai perspective. Although your words may sound hard-hitting unfortunately I have to agree with them (well some of them). Thai women are amongst the most beautiful on the planet but make no mistake, Thai prostitutes aren’t any different from western ones. Apart from the blatantly obvious that is.
Lasting relationships between bar girls and prostitutes have little chance but can and have worked. Like any relationship it takes a massive amount of understanding, commitment, loyalty, patience, a genuine desire to compromise and of course a heap load of love for each other. Anyone thinking of undertaking such a relationship needs to be prepared for one hell of a ride (and I don’t just mean between the sheets). The western guy needs to prepare for something a little more than just being lavished with attention, care, flirting and sex in return for money and support. And the bar girl, well she needs feel the desire to be faithful and must throw away her relationship rule book. Of course each applies to both parties. One of the hardest things is no matter what you do you will always face scrutiny and stigma from people around you, even from people who don’t know you. The Thai will be looked down upon for sleeping with a westerner and the westerner will appear to be a sugar daddy or worse a sex tourist.
If you’re lucky enough to find a Thai lady who genuinely loves you and both of you are prepared to give 100% commitment to each other you will never ever want for anything else.
Bill.
PS. the missus has written a few articles on the subject, I’ll try to get her to post them up at a later time.
The problem is, if we have a Thai girlfriend, no matter what her background, there will be suspicious stares, comments, judgments ect. from time to time.
She could be as pure as the driven snow, yet some people will assume that you have “purchased” her because she is Thai and you are farang.
What can we do about that?
I like your opinion. Every country should have both good and bad ones. Most of them work as bar girls for money, only few of them work for love and to find right man for happy family. You should realize that , before makind decision to get married with her.
Very wise insight of human nature… I think a woman who is bright, courious as well as honest and knowing her own mind would be very interesting, Thai or Farang! If I had come to Thailand as a young man, I’m sure I would have been suduced by the beauty of many willing ladies but my youth has passed and I have only a few regrets. At 60 I think one loyal woman would be plenty. I have considered moving to Asia as I have traveled in Asia and have friends I enjoy there. Thank you for you opinion concerning foolish old men with “large hearts and small brains”. Jerry USA
Excellent article man, you’ve hit the spot with thai girl scam artists. It’s true most of them are just whores and scam artists, but just the one you’d find in bars or massage parlors, if you’d go to a regular joint i bet you can find a lot of thai decent girls. If your a 60 old dude and you’re hanging around with a nice ass 20 yr old thai girl, it’s pretty clear she’s staying for the money.
hehehe that was great, all these guys come here for 1 reason we all know it.
and then they get angry because the callgirls left them hehe, the thai saying really could be used as a medaphore.
no money no honey!!!
well unless u find a nice thai girl(not working as bar girl)
I would say that 95% of men come to Thailand just for sex. There are much better beaches in other parts of the world. And Thai food is not worth the trip.
I would disagree with JonnyK in that many of us travel to Thailand for more than just sex. He’s right that there are better beaches. Some might even argue that Thai food in the US or Europe is even better than some of the Thai food in Thailand (because it’s been adapted to farang tastes). There are a lot of places better than Thailand if you want to do a spot by spot comparison.
But it’s the whole package that makes Thailand such a wonderful place. It’s the whole mai ben rai attitude. It’s the Thai smile. It’s the wai. It’s because it is a world so different from what we know and the more we get to know it the more we realize we how little we know.
Touche Billy…
Great input. I hope you find the time, one day, to explain the hidden hierarchy in Thai society that you mention!
There is also the fact that in Western countries there are social programs. In the case of a “bar girl” one never knows how she got there. Also, it is the fact you knew her “when”.
One thing,how is a respectable woman treated? What are the social mores that a farang needs to know? In most western countries men are treated very rudely that sets us up for when an attractive woman treats us with consideration. Rude behavior by the wife is a common place item in art forms and stories. What is it in Thailand? What are the expectations?
Great post! Non Ja knows and speaks the truth.
Nice article. Thanks. 🙂 Eugene
This guy is the shit.
Makes me agree in a lot of sense. I have a question in mind too what kind of men are these complaining about their experiences, like are they educated etc that seems their judgments aren’t really good. It takes two to Tango but I don’t want to exclude also of being too trusting. kind and generous. The intentions maybe good, it just happened that they weren’t really served well.
Frankly, we hear the same experiences in different countries, guess it’s not about one’s culture or country but it’s in individual’s upbringing, values or yeah,family. Well, I’m talking about both sides, the victim and the con.
I should say I do appreciate that these victims came out in the open as well as there could be more and more who could have the same delimma(at least lessen :)) Thanks.
For those who have victimized farangs, I just hope too that you won’t forget that money aren’t from the streets or like leaves on the trees that are just picked. Their respective currency may be higher than Baht but I believe they are still the same- HARD EARNED. And if someone helps you in some way, I don’t think that person deserves to be treated the way you’ve treated them. Do you know KARMA? How about THE GOLDEN RULE?
Lastly, oh, I almost forgot the issue generally talks about bargirls. I haven’t realized ’till this moment that they are such clever, genius, intelligent and smart earning that well without much investment. Perhaps better than MBA holders.:)
One thing I’m sure though, they have the “skills”(hmm..verbal, physical, motor??:))which maybe the victims reason why at some point made them trap. I just hope I’m wrong. Just some questions, did the victims just gave out those cash without getting anything back from the CON?(of course I don’t mean money!) Or okay, I’ll ask this way, what made them so bold and brave to ask the amount? Have they done or at least given you something ahead prior to their requests? And why is it that you didn’t have the courage to say NO? Don’t blame it on LOVE. I could take your life right now and I’d just say because of LOVE.
Thank you Nonja for the post. It’s good to see some perspective. Don’t be sorry for your comment. it’s definitely your right. “)
if you really want a genuine thai lady and i assure you there are more of them than the not so genuine, then simply go to the non tourist areas of thailand,i know it will be hell of alot quieter but beleive me its where you get the real deal.
plus you get the added advantage of being the only fallang for miles and its a mind blowing experience with entire village populations wanting to get to know you and every girl in town noticing you.
you may need abit of bravery though as nobody will probably speak english and you can feel abit out on a limb but if you are a genuine fallang wanting a real wife whose not hundreds of years younger than you then go rural alone.
it beats the main euro trash areas where the fat ugly bold tatooed gimps abuse the bar girls and spread disease. ( sorry i hate those so called men)
real thai ladies are absolute gems they will love you forever and in turn you give them utmost respect because they deserve it. yes they will be poorer than maybe a bangkok girl and yes they will want a better life but to be honest alot in those unknown villages are happy with what they have and dont want knights in shining armour appearing to save them so you have to spend abit of time in those areas learning the culture and getting the feel of the place.
remember you are not sex gods at all the hookers will let you think you are its their job the real women will treat you different but you will get the better lady.
Go on be adventurous see past the night life.
Steve says:
“then simply go to the non tourist areas of thailand,i know it will be hell of alot quieter but beleive me its where you get the real deal. plus you get the added advantage of being the only fallang for miles”
Been there, done that, got the t-shirt, complete waste of time and as boring as bat shit mate.
No offense meant Steve but what can a farang do while he’s experiencing culture up in Nakhon Nowhere? Help plough the fields? The truth is that you get completely fed up being unable to have a normal, intelligent conversation with anyone. Not only that, if you’re not an inland person, as I aren’t, where do you go for a swim?
I tried it once and ended up splitting up with the girl because I told her, after we’d returned from the sojourn into the land that that time forgot, “don’t ever ask me to go up there again because the answer is NO”
“The rice paddies are so picturesque at sunset” doesn’t do it for me.
Mega hi,
I think Steve was just speaking about his belief. Perhaps he had the great experience that was why he was strong about it. And I’m sorry to hear about your experience. People have different choices and preferences. We view things, people and situation according to how they make us happpy.And yes, happiness is relative as well. Person A may be happy with one but Person B isn’t.
Anyway, I think people are the same. The values differ perhaps on their own perpective as well. It has nothing really to do with culture and nationality, just who they are. There is a commonality but then it doesn’t mean all.
There’s nothing to be sorry about mate. It happened when I was new to the LOS and I had limited knowledge of the way things are here. All part of the experience of being here I suppose. Like I said, I’m not one of the ‘rice fields are so picturesque at sunset’ crowd.
Know what you mean about the culture thing and the way that some farangs push that silly barrow. Try telling an Isaan rice farmer that his culture is more important than earning a living and a full belly, he’ll laugh in your face and think you’re a complete tosser. At the end of the day, their wants and needs are much the same as ours really. I just don’t have any interest in the Thai rural experience and the accompanying poverty, that is a part of it, for most of the populace living in those areas. Some guys seem to be quite okay with that; buying the land (that will never be in their name) and building the big house. If they’re happy, good luck to them. I could never get my head around buying property that I couldn’t own and never will. Just another reason why I’ll never fit into the rural experience over here I suppose.
So, why indeed do so many farang end up with bar girls? I think the answer is fairly simple isn’t it? Like attracts like. If you like sitting in bars and getting shit faced you’ll end up interacting with bar girls. Simple really isn’t it. I suppose there’s lots of fellows out there that enjoy playing four in a row, hammering nails into blocks of wood (Phuket) or trying to converse with girls who have the intellectual levels of twelve year olds. Whatever floats your boat I suppose?
There are plenty of good (read non bar girls) Thai ladies out there. You just need to go to the right places or get involved in activities, other than being at a bar, to meet them. Go to the gym, go to yoga classes, go and join a scuba club, go and do some jungle trekking. These are the kinds of activities that normal Thai ladies get involved in. The majority of bar girls are too lazy, or too stupid, to involve themselves in any of the things I’ve listed above.
I always have a good laugh when out for a days’ scuba diving, in Pattaya, and I see some poor fool with previous nights bar fine on the boat. The object of his desires normally spends the entire trip curled up asleep and only rising, like the good little bush monkey’s they are, to fill their little bellies when the food comes out at lunch time. If it was any more predictable it would be pathetic. But still, it’s great entertainment to see them making complete fools of themselves pandering to the needs of a girl who, in the light of day, isn’t quite the ravishing beauty he picked up the night before. Truth be known, most of them are butt ugly. On the odd occasion when of them ladies has attempted to engage me in conversation, I’ve usually ended the attempt quickly by asking what compass direction the sun comes up in. The term stunned mullet comes to mind.
Beyond the need to be in a horizontal position, with one of these girls, there’s really not much else they can offer. If you can’t speak Thai then you’ll need to engage in limited conversations in a mixture of broken English and babies babble. Some guys are quite happy with that, good luck to them is all I can say. It only takes about hour (the length of a short time) for me to be completely bored with them. Each to their own I suppose.
I completely understand. Yes, you’re right. I don’t want to buy anything either which I can’t own, if it’s just a small amount then I’d rather give it away but big purchases are another story.
hi mega yeah no offence taken and its fair comment what you said, i suppose not many would spend money travelling half across the world for that.
i first started off hearing of the thai/fallang disasters a few years ago and decided a different approach, i learnt to speak fluent thai ( it didnt help much but got me by)
i enjoyed my time in the rural areas maybe i should have clarified a little, i meant small towns off the tourist track still with shops and cars lol. i tried to impress the locals with my thai but only got puzzled looks as the language can be so diferent in many parts of thailan.
i did meet a lady and yes it took 2 weeks of no inteligent conversation but for me anyway it worked and she is only couple years younger so at least at the airport i dont look like a dirty old man.
i would still recomend trying it that way maybe if time was no option but dont get me wrong i love the sea and the diving and all that is what a holiday should be.
Hi Steve. Kudos to you for having the patience to learn to speak Thai fluently. I’ve been in the LOS for fifteen years now and , much as I don’t like to admit it, my Thai is only at about the 20% level. Good enough to get by on I suppose but not good enough to defend one’s self, if the need should ever arise.
Okay, I understand now about your situation regarding going to the non tourist areas to look for a lady. Provincial towns aren’t the same as villages. In fact, I’ve spent a few days in a place called Petchabun, a few years back, and thought it was a nice break away from the madness of Bangkok and Pattaya. I stayed in a nice hotel which was on the main Road in (can’t remember the name of it now) and it was inexpensive, had good Thai food and a nice pool. I did some day trips up to a National Park area to the North called Khao kor. A very mountainous area which runs through to Laos and had a history of communist insurgency back around the time of the Vietnam war. There’s a little museum up there with lots of military paraphernalia (tanks, helicopters, field artillery, etc and a large model topographical map showing the areas of engagement and the communist strongholds during the conflict. The only problem was that all the info was in Thai language so I didn’t get a real understanding of the history of it. Anyway, if you’re ever up that way, it’s worth checking out for a day.
This is the best post on the whole damn site.
haha…right on the spot, I must say. Good job!
Hey what about those innocent looking Thai girls that scams farangs too…
Thais is on the top of the heap in line with PL for love scams which is worse than the Nigerian 419 scams.. as they say “I Chop Your Dollar”
i really apreciate your work.
hi,
i am indian and i am in love with one muslim girl from bangkok.she works with me on cruise line.how are muslim girls in thailand?
Very rare in Bangkok, Rambo. Thailand is 90% Buddhist. Most of the Muslims live in the south of Thailand near Malaysia. Obviously there are some Thai Muslims living in Bangkok but not many. Most that I have run into are students and plan on returning back to the south when they finish school.
how i can get her email id or tel.no.actually i have her adress.any website can help me.thank you thai person for your time.
Well, I’m not very hip on Muslim dating traditions in general or those specific to Thai Muslims so can’t be of much help on this one. 🙂 Anybody else have any experience?